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Dean Ortland Whistleblower Speaks Out on Workplace Bullying Part 2

By November 10, 2023November 16th, 20232 Comments

Julie Roys Podcast

Dean Ortland Whistleblower Speaks Out on Workplace Bullying Part 2

Continuation of interview with Emily Hyland, whistleblower, and Paul Coughlin, founder of an anti-bullying organization to combat bullying in schools & other organizations and to build “courage, character, and leadership for life”  The Protectors : Freedom from Bullying  . He is the author of Raising Bully-Proof Kids, Five Secrets Great Dads Know, and No More Christian Nice Guy. Their impressive bios are included on the the Roys website.  

This podcast is accompanied by a transcript that includes timestamps.


This segment covers the news in Emily’s ongoing case. Her case was heard by the Illinois Department of Human Rights, and elevated to the Human Rights Commission. A finding that her report of bullying was met with retaliation was substantiated. Additionally, there is an upcoming trial for unpaid wages involving the Illinois Department of Labor.

Those of you who witnessed the recent history at Chapel Hill Bible Church, heard the personal stories of some staff members, and read newspaper accounts  might also recognize several patterns in this situation. Recognition of patterns is critical to clearly discerning truth. 


I mean, listening as a mother, my heart just goes out to you and to your family, for what you’ve been through. And it’s hard enough for adults [when a parent has been abused at a church], but for children to process how this happens, and to distinguish between the people that hurt them who are symbols of the Church of God. It’s just so painful to see that and it just requires so much prayer, so much care. –Julie Roys (section that starts at 15:42)

 I think that knowing the risks, that you could be fired and disfellowshipped, and the House of Cards will come crumbling down. If you know those risks, you still stand up, and you still speak the truth. …The other consequences coming from either tolerating sin or silencing your conscience; those may seem like a preferable outcome in the short term. But they are so costly to your soul and to your spirit that to be out of an abusive and coercive church is always better than being in one. So, to know those risks, and it’s painful, it could be awful, it could be the worst thing you ever go through in your whole life. But do it anyway…  –Emily Hyland (section that starts at 20:37)

We need to realize that most narcissists see people in two ways, people who are either below them or a threat… They are constantly measuring things in order to keep themselves at the top of the hierarchy… They’ll talk a lot about the kingdom of heaven, but it’s really about their kingdom. –Paul Coughlin (section that starts at 22:58)  

[Narcissists] have three things in common….

  • an inflated self-regard. They really believe they’re more important than other people….
  • They also have a great sense of entitlement; things are owed to them again, because they’re wonderful. …
  • And this third component is antagonism. … in faith centric organizations, the best bullies harm you, but they smile on their face and a lilt in their voice. They’re the most damaging ones, because they hide their antagonism. Their words are designed to humiliate, and really destroy you. But they do it in such a way that it almost seems like okay for them to do that. It goes back to that cognitive dissonance that we talked about earlier. The look on the face is kind, but the words are poison. That’s all on purpose. They have been practicing that dark skill for a long time, and most of them have gotten away with it for a long time… –Paul Coughlin (section that starts at 22:58)